Resto-Mod '57 brougham in progress

[57cadillac]

I finally made the move to the modified forum now that my brougham is no longer on an all original restoration route.

Aside from that, there has been some progress with the custom frame but i am still waiting to get word that it has arrived at the shop.
To date all of the metal work excluding the floor and trunk pan has been completed, and i have already narrowed it down to a few paint choices.

Even though this brougham may be getting customized, it's not quite going to look this extreme. > http://www.di-customcars.ca/05_3_completed___58%20Caddy.php

Here are some pictures of what it was like when i acquired it.

http://i761.photobucket.com/albums/xx258/datyonabg/cadillac%20eldorado%20brougham/DSC06188.jpg
http://i761.photobucket.com/albums/xx258/datyonabg/cadillac%20eldorado%20brougham/DSC06189.jpg
http://i761.photobucket.com/albums/xx258/datyonabg/cadillac%20eldorado%20brougham/DSC06192.jpg
http://i761.photobucket.com/albums/xx258/datyonabg/cadillac%20eldorado%20brougham/DSC06193.jpg

[Stampie]

Welcome to the dark side.  Want to give a quick history for those that don't visit the mobo?

Stampie

[EZ]

I LOVE '58 Cadillacs!!!  Keep us updated with pictures of the progress.

BTW........nice looking Coronet 440 in the back ground.  For sale?

[guidematic]

 I'll be watching this one!

 Mike

[Gary]

Welcome to the site. Please keep us updated as you make progress. Looked to be a nice car before you started, so we're eager to see the finished result.
Gary

[57cadillac]

Well, to answer a few of the replies, the pictures were from the previous owner's storage building and the other cars weren't for sale from what i remember.

As far as history, nearly two years ago now i was bored and went looking around for a decently priced more valuable and worthwhile car to restore. As i have learned, a '57 brougham isn't a great choice for the first restoration you perform. So when i found a brougham for sale in Alberta i got in contact with the seller and managed to work out a deal even though i had not seen it in person (i did have pictures at least). I went out and fully paid for the car and was there to watch it get loaded up for transport out to Ontario, where i was going to move to. Once i did move from Winnipeg to the Toronto area, work promptly got in the way and the cadillac sat throughout the summer of 2010 (inside), when i had enough and sent it to a restoration shop.

Now, when i sent it off, i totally was set in having a 100% original restoration done on the brougham.
Although once they started taking the car apart, it became apparent that the amount of work involved would make the cost far out of my range and the restoration would be at least 3-4 years long. This is why i did some planning and started coming up with ways to customize it.
The basic vision i have is to make my brougham into a 'close' representation of what a modern day brougham would be.

Aside from the personal part of the story, my knowledge of where brougham #184 has been and who has owned it is very limited.
When i first bought the car, what i was told was that the previous owner in Calgary i bought it from had bought it from a cadillac collector of sorts in B.C. who had #184 sitting in the outdoors as a parts car, which cause a lot of damage and rust to the floor and trunk pan and chrome parts. I don't know how long the guy in B.C. had owned this car for, yet i was told that it had been bought and brought up from somewhere in the US. Going forward a bit, i managed to track down the auto shop in B.C. that was where the brougham had sat and was unfortunately told that the guy that had owned both the shop and the cadillac had passed away.

For an idea of the condition of the car when the previous owner in Calgary had bought it, the entire floor pan had to be replaced and the license plate frame on the rear bumper had been crushed from the car sitting on the ground, in addition, there were very few parts remaining, so almost all of them had to be tracked down and bought back. Unfortunately none of the vanity set was present, as was the case of the original #'s matching engine and trans.

[guidematic]

 Interesting story.

 So this car was really saved from being a parts car and is coming back to life. That's certainly encouraging. Also, you are very close to me. I'll look forward to seeing the car in person sometime in the future.

 Mike

[57cadillac]

Well, there currently isn't much to see of the car but a stripped down metal shell right now, although I'm hoping that it should be finished by this coming spring just in time to hit the show season.

As far as the customization goes, i have so many ideas to be incorporated that it's hard to remember all of them lol.

On the topic of engine choice, the northstar really sounds like the most unique. Since the sts-v had a supercharged northstar that made an impressive 460-470hp, i thought about getting a northstar for rebuilding and getting it outfitted with a twin turbo system (depending on whether the cost for this would run into new crate engine range or not).
I have looked at engines from other car brands, but it wouldn't be quite as much of a true Cadillac that way. (bmw m5 v10 or mercedes v12 would do nicely)
There are some gm crate engines that interest me, the current model cts-v engine being my favorite even though it is a bit pricey.
I'm looking at something that can manage around the 500hp mark since the brougham is so heavy and large.
I would also want it to run on pump gas and still have an abundance of parts available (in other words something that wasn't built 20 or more years ago).

The interior will remain original, with the exception of color choice and modern electronic upgrades. The custom frame is being built right now and will have a spring suspension and disc brakes on all corners, so it will be able to perform better than an original brougham.

That should be a decent idea for you guys of what i have planned.

[Carnut]

The Northstar has very thin castings. I would be leery of a used one. I will be the first to suggest a Cadillac 500. Not only does it keep your Car all cadillac, it makes huge amounts of torque at usable engine speeds. Go with a 400 turbo trans and a very tall rear gear.

[INTMD8]

On the topic of engine choice, the northstar really sounds like the most unique. Since the sts-v had a supercharged northstar that made an impressive 460-470hp, i thought about getting a northstar for rebuilding and getting it outfitted with a twin turbo system (depending on whether the cost for this would run into new crate engine range or not).

I'll be watching the progress on this one.  I actually bought my car (brougham #70) with intentions to resto-mod it but I'm a bit conflicted as it is 99% complete with original matching drivetrain.  Part of me says that it's my duty to do a factory resto and the other part says I should just build it how I want it.

I'll throw in my .02 on the drivetrain since I've contemplated the same.

First, you have to decide how much power do you want. 

I tune cars for a living so I've tuned STS-V's (supercharged northstar) and also CTS-V's with the supercharged LSA.  Also have done many twin turbo LS's. My Chevelle has one actually-

http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/7488/chevelle562011033.jpg
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/6643/chevelle562011048.jpg

Supercharged Northstar-  The one I tuned made 400rwhp and was backed by the 6l80, 6-speed auto.  Very smooth engine and moved the car well but not blazingly fast. I like the idea of this engine as it is a true cadillac motor and not a "corporate" motor. It would be adequate in a Brougham but nothing crazy. (maybe just what the car needs)

Turbo Northstar- I have no experience with this but I'm sure it could be an excellent choice. Only downside is much much more cost per HP compared to an LS variant.

CTS-V LSA- They make some nice power. With just a pulley/induction/exhaust/tune they will put down around 550rwhp. I will say that I don't really enjoy the blower whine, seems out of place on a luxury car.

Turbo LS/LQ- The engine in my Chevelle is basically just a stock 6.0 LQ9 from an escalade with 2 stock Buick Grand National turbos.  Makes 600rwhp, gets 20mpg, runs 10's and has instant response on the street. Probably the best choice in my opinion, just isn't very exotic.

I think the ultimate would be a copy of the Cadillac "Sixteen" concept engine, which is essentially a V16 LS1.  I spoke to a few places about building one and the estimate was between 100-300k.  Yeah, a bit too pricey for me

[57cadillac]

I actually bought my car (brougham #70) with intentions to resto-mod it but I'm a bit conflicted as it is 99% complete with original matching drivetrain. Part of me says that it's my duty to do a factory resto and the other part says I should just build it how I want it.

I'll throw in my .02 on the drivetrain since I've contemplated the same.

Supercharged Northstar-  The one I tuned made 400rwhp and was backed by the 6l80, 6-speed auto.  Very smooth engine and moved the car well but not blazingly fast. I like the idea of this engine as it is a true cadillac motor and not a "corporate" motor. It would be adequate in a Brougham but nothing crazy. (maybe just what the car needs)

Turbo Northstar- I have no experience with this but I'm sure it could be an excellent choice. Only downside is much much more cost per HP compared to an LS variant.

CTS-V LSA- They make some nice power. With just a pulley/induction/exhaust/tune they will put down around 550rwhp. I will say that I don't really enjoy the blower whine, seems out of place on a luxury car.

Turbo LS/LQ- The engine in my Chevelle is basically just a stock 6.0 LQ9 from an escalade with 2 stock Buick Grand National turbos.  Makes 600rwhp, gets 20mpg, runs 10's and has instant response on the street. Probably the best choice in my opinion, just isn't very exotic.

I think the ultimate would be a copy of the Cadillac "Sixteen" concept engine, which is essentially a V16 LS1.  I spoke to a few places about building one and the estimate was between 100-300k.  Yeah, a bit too pricey for me

Nice to hear from you. By the looks of it, you've made more progress with your brougham than i have in the past half year it's been getting restored. You have the same dilemma that i had at first, only yours is more complicated because the car is in great condition and all the original parts are there.

Just to update on #184, the frame is still in the building process, and I was supposed to have gotten news this week about it.
Hopefully once the frame is done it will be quick and easy with the paint coming up right afterwards. Then after the paint the fun starts lol.

To start off about engine choices, I have an '06 dodge charger with the 5.7 hemi that i had a single rear-mount turbo system installed.
It is running at 5psi with a relatively stock engine (tune and fuel injectors the only exceptions) and it makes about 380 rwhp, which is not crazy but still enough to provide some fun while driving.

Back to the brougham, since it will be quite a bit heavier than my charger and needs the extra power, and because it isn't going to go racing, my thoughts are that between 500 and 600 hp (before drivetrain loss) should be just right.
Because i'm keeping as much of the bodywork in stock condition, there won't be room for nice wide tires at the back, so even if i went for more power than that it would be pointless.
The hardest part with choosing an engine is that there is so little choice when it comes to modern cadillac engines that are somewhat exotic/unique.

Another idea I had was to make a dual mode exhaust system, similar to what is on the maserat quattroporte and most exotic luxury cars these days, with the difference for the setup on my brougham being that one mode would be as quiet as possible, with the other providing a nice, mild sounding exhaust note that still gets your attention.

[Helmut]

Very interesting. I purchased a 58 project the had a crate 4.6 northstar in it and will be looking at an LS. It had all the mods including the headers and frame for the motor mounts and a custom oi ll pan. my only problem was the water pump at the rear of the engine. it would require the firewall to be modified

[Dr. John]

Very interesting. I purchased a 58 project the had a crate 4.6 northstar in it and will be looking at an LS. It had all the mods including the headers and frame for the motor mounts and a custom oi ll pan. my only problem was the water pump at the rear of the engine. it would require the firewall to be modified

Grab a cut off wheel!!!

[INTMD8]

The custom frame is being built right now and will have a spring suspension and disc brakes on all corners, so it will be able to perform better than an original brougham.

Who's building the frame? Did your original have rust issues or did you not think it would do what you wanted it to do?

[57cadillac]

Fatman Fabrications is building the frame. It should be arriving sometime later this week so I'm interested to see what it looks like.
Art Morrison was the first choice for a custom frame, although I thought that the extra cost was not justified. The only benefit I could see was having a warranty on the new frame.

The original frame did have some rust issues, although it is still reusable, just not really suitable for my situation.
In other words, the original frame is still usable it's just that at the decision point I figured that so many original parts are missing from the car (#s matching drivetrain, air suspension system, vanities) that i would be better off with the custom frame and doing a resto-mod.

The original frame probably could have been used for what i had planned, but it would really limit the choices I could have. For example, the new frame will have clearance for an exhaust up to 3", a lower overall height, and not to mention there will be room for slightly wider tires and for a lot more interesting drivetrain choices.